So, back in July, we started discussing the Parable of the Wicked Tenants but we didn't get very far and that's my fault. Maybe we can get further this time around...
In the version I've read, Jesus tells the parable and then asks the Pharisees and chief priests around him what will happen to the tenants when the owner of the vineyard comes back (after the tenants have killed his son). They respond that they will meet a "wretched end" and the owner will put someone responsible in their place.
Jesus then points out (and they realize) that He is talking about them and the awful way they've managed His church. It seems that the owner is God, the tenants (at least at that moment) were the leaders of the church, and the vineyard they were supposed tend is the church.
So what does this parable mean to us? If we take the perspective mentioned above, then it is interesting to me that the ultimate state of the vineyard isn't called into question. Does that change your perspective on what's going on in this parable?
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Now we see the parable in action. The tenants didn't listen when they were told what they needed to know.
I can see what the message was to them, but I'm not as clear on the message to us today. We don't have the benefit of Jesus getting up in our faces using parables to point out in an immediate way exactly what were supposed to do as it is happening. We can learn from the examples in scripture, but that leads me to my second point...
I can see that we're supposed to listen and follow the intent of God as explained in His word. Surely this doesn't mean we're supposed to follow the words of Christ without question as they are told to us by some authority figure. That seems to be at least part of the point of this parable. Yet so many people (including religious leaders) come to different conclusions about what (at least some) passages in the Bible are supposed to mean.
I guess the real question I'm trying to get at is, "Where does the 'Truth' come from?"
How would you recognise a prophet?
It would have to be someone wearing a long, flowing robe, carrying a staff, and telling everyone that things are going to be the way I think they will be. ;)
That's an excellent question. I've often wondered if I would recognize Jesus if He were to stand in front of me and not officially "reveal" Himself. I would like to think that I would and that I would recognize a true prophet the same way... that I would be open to listening to what they have to say and allow it to resonate within me to see if it rings true.
One problem, as predicted by Jesus, is that there will be many false prophets. Discerning the true from the false is not the only challenge, though. If we're to accept the teachings of Christ as children do, then how do we maintain enough skepticism to tell liars from true prophets and yet do that without becoming hardened?
Even Mary and the disciples had difficulty recognising the risen Jesus, but he told us we would know him when we gave him a glass of water. What makes you different from the tenants of the vineyard? How would you recognise a prophet?
Ahhh... now we come to the next section of Matthew. The separation of the sheep and the goats which is done not based on whether you have done any number of things we usually judge ourselves or other people on today, but rather on whether you helped the least of those around you.
It all comes down to this quote from Matthew Chapter 25, verse 40: 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.'
So I find myself facing the question I try to ask myself each day and strive to answer positively each time (and am still struggling to get right): Who have you helped today?
So, because you can recognise the Christ in the poor and needy, you don't have to recognise a prophet? Why would prophecy be a gift of the spirit then?
No, but it's a first step. Feeding the hungry and serving the poor provides us an opportunity to discard the noise of all the false idols we carry with us and greater clarity on what really matters. In turn, false messages of salvation (and false truths) will ring hollow in our ears.
But the spirit lives within us, so how can we be carrying false idols? I take your point about service, which belongs to your question about the state of the vineyard. You probably understand that many of the poor are drug addicted, gamblers, alcoholic, mentally ill, or criminals. Are we all called to serve them? What would a false message of salvation be?
What's the hold up?
There are three questions you're asking here...
1) But the spirit lives within us, so how can we be carrying false idols?
Anyone can be tempted by false idols. Money and power are two examples that come to mind.
2) You probably understand that many of the poor are drug addicted, gamblers, alcoholic, mentally ill, or criminals. Are we all called to serve them?
Which of these would you have me not serve?
3) What would a false message of salvation be?
Any message wrapped in a salvation story that is used to manipulate others for personal gain.
For example, it seems than many modern televangelists are leading their flocks down a path of deception, destruction, using hijacked messages of salvation. Prosperity gospel evangelists and religious leaders who sit in absolute judgment over people they've never even met (unless they hand over some cash and cry at the right moment) ring hollow in my ears. In these cases the salvation message itself isn't false, but it is being manipulated to that selfish, inappropriate end. Ultimately the person manipulated may find a closer connection with Christ, but there is a much greater chance that this person will eventually realize the way they were manipulated and be turned off to the salvation message.
So what are your answers to your own questions?
Sometimes I am tempted to make judgments, but of course I can only account for my own response to challenges. Some people are called to grow food or families, sell, fix or make things, and many other occupations, and you can see love in their work. We would all be poorer without them, including the poor. Who am I to question or judge their motives by accusing them of carrying false idols? But you and I are still at the same place. How do we know which message to listen to? Is prophecy inherent in the Spirit which has been given to us and how do we know how to listen to it? Is Al Gore a prophet?
Wonderful questions. How would you answer them?
Don't be lazy. I wasn't sent over here for you to waste my time.
Me? Lazy? Maybe, but I am often a person who enjoys the reflection of others on their own questions. That's only lazy if I use that as an excuse to avoid answering a question. I would argue that's not the case here.
But since I'm unable to softly coax your perspective, my answers follow...
>How do we know which message to
>listen to?
We should listen to the messages we encounter, allow them to resonate with our understanding of scripture, and determine if they ring true.
>Is prophecy inherent in the Spirit
>which has been given to us?
Are you asking if I believe that everyone has the ability to reveal Truly divine will? If so, I would say we do. I would also say that many use that inappropriately which is the cause of much sufffering. It's also what caused me to use the terminology that some people carry around crap that distracts them from the Truth. Whatever the manifestation of that may be, the result is the inappropriate use of salvation knowledge (for lack of a better phrase) to manipulate others.
>how do we know how to listen to it?
I've explained my process for that above. What's yours?
>Is Al Gore a prophet?
If by "prophet" we mean someone who accurately predicts the future, I would preface my response by saying that I don't concern myself greatly with predictions like that. When such predictions keep you from doing what it takes, utilizing the gifts given to you, to help and love others every single day they are merely a grand distraction.
If instead you're asking me whether Al Gore is able to reveal the Truth of divine will, I would say he certainly can.
You have answered well grasshopper (at last). Prophecy is given to us in prayer, love, and spirit. Good prophecy has a distinct ring to it (tones of various dimension), and like our dreams, usually has more to do with us and now than grand predictions of the future. You were drawn back to this parable of the vineyard. What do you think you are looking for, considering that I answered the question that you asked the first time?
I passed? Yeah!... "I'd like to say thank you on behalf of the group and ourselves and I hope we've passed the audition". ;)
With these BBS postings, I'm attempting to encourage discussion. I also didn't want to leave this specific parable without taking the time to have one. I'm always searching for answers and input, but cooperative discourse where everyone comes to the table in order to refresh their understanding and learn something new is the real goal of the journey.
So what did you learn (other than I'm not always in a hurry to end a thread of discussion)?
I read a comment about the Gospels by an atheist. The atheist suggested that one of the dramatic elements of the Gospels, the use of a fop, was inherited from the Greek writing traditions of the day. The fop he was referring to was a pharisee, although the description equally applies to Peter. The fop was a device which made the wise responses of the hero seem so much more wise by comparison with the bumbling understanding of the fop.
The heart-warming and reassuring thing I've learned in that same vein is that the Apostles were not the brightest bulbs in the pack. Christ didn't select them because they were perfect people who always said and did the right things. Peter (the rock of His church) was even called Satan at one point. Imagine if the guilt-ridden Christians of today had Christ come down and call them Satan. That would be a tough one for me, that's for sure.
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